Land Rover Defender 3.5 (ex Camel Trohpy support vehicle)

[Philip Lochner]

Last update: 16 Jul 2008

ECU: MS-2/ V3 / 2.884 with continuous Baro, Innovate LC-1 WBO
Vehicle: 1990 Land Rover Defender
Engine: 3.5L V8 8.13 CR Mechanically standard, after market exhaust manifold branches
Gearbox: 5sp Manual.
Fuelling system: Stock EFI system from 3.9 Discovery Series 1 (HiZ injectors), controlled by MS-2 using 4/alternating injection sequence. I've tried 8/simultaneous but the engine is too small (for these injectors) resulting in too small PWs at idle.
Spark: MS controls spark advance/retard with tach input coming from stock dissy mounted VR ignition module using a 1K pull-up resistor to feed a 12V square wave to MS for tach input. MS-2 controls the on-board VB921 which in turn controls a TP100 ignition module situated close to the coil. Both centrifugal and vacuum advance is still active on the dissy to ensure best alignment of the rotor with the plug terminals for spark. The MS timing map does therefore not have absolute timing but only the "delta" being added (or subtracted) to whatever centrifugal and vacuum advance is doing.

16 Jul 2008
Replaced the inline fuel pump with "in-tank" pump for early Range Rover classic (and NAS EFI Defenders). This solved the cavitation problems experienced with the in-line pump resuling from the standard fuel line from the tank to the pump being too small. Now one can hardly hear the EFI pump.

26 May 2008
Were having MAJOR issues with Innovate LC-1 on this car. DOWNgraded the LC-1 FW to 1.0 and now the LC-1 is behaving more like the LC-1s I've come to know (and like).

7 May 2008
Cavitation of the external EFI fuel pump has been improved (but not gone altogether) by removing the original pump in the tank and replacing it with a pipe. The cleaned injectors and "happier" fuel pump has not resulted in AFRs being any more stable. Therefore it MUST be due to the worn cam (or LC-1 ??). The owner and I saw at least 4 of the 16 lobes visibly worn when we had the inlet manifold off. The car "broke down" with me today (with wife on board). It turned out the owner had wired in a fuseable link into the main 12V supply to MS related items but did not fasten the Nylock nuts holding the cable terminals. This caused intermittent 12V failures and lots of stress on my part. The ownwer will "pay" for that...

I also wired in a TP100 ignition module such that MS is now ? highly isolated ? from any highvoltage stuff.

7 May 2008
Read on the forum that direct coil control can cause resets on MS-2 - such as what I'm getting at about 3500rpm (with hindsight this might very well have been caused by the intermittent fuseable link that was not fastened properly). Solution: Let the VB921 control a TP100 ignition module co-located at the coil. Although I removed the pump from the tank and replaced it with a pipe from which the externally mounted fuel pump will draw fuel, I also found a fuel pump that can replace the existing fuel pump in the tank and still deliver the required 3 bar of pressure. This will not only move the pump out of harm's way but will also offer the most quiet mounting arrangement! Things are now coming together nicely on this project!

5 May 2008
Fitted another fuel pump (from the Jag) today to see if that changed anything and fitted a fuel pressure gauge inline. Different pump made no change to the unstable AFRs and fuel presure is 2.2 bar when the engine runs and 2.6 bar when it does not run (with both pumps). Will have the injectors cleaned tomorrrow to see if that changes anything.

3 May 2008
Today was spent hunting for a vacuum leak. Eventually found the leak immediatly below the butterfly where a heater element is bolted to the throttle body which I removed as this is not required in our hot climate. Air came in via the bolt holes. Also found that the one IAC I bought off ebay did not work at all and the other stopped working after about the 3 time is was supposed to do its thing. AFRs still very noisy. Will have to look at a different pump solution.

2 May 2008
Fitted the EFI manifold, connected all water, fuel vacuum and electrical connections and it started! I used the msq from my 4.6 to start with reducing the req_fuel by 3.5/4.6

Goes fine but AFRs are highly unstable despite the PWs being very stable. This leads me to conclude that the EFI fuel pump in series with the standard fuel pump in the tank might not be working well. I suspect it cavitates resulting in large and rapid pressure changes in the fuel system causing relatively unstable amounts of fuel being delivered.

Only other problem is that it idles very high despite IAC (and the base idle bypass screw) being fully closed. Suspect a vacuum leak somewhere.


1 May 2008
This is a standard Land Rover Defender V8 3.5L with dual SU carbs which I am converting to fuel injection.

Today and yesterday I fitted the LC-1 and MS-2. MS-2 is at this point only controlling timing via the distributor. I'm using the standard ignition module with a pull-up resistor to present a 0V 12V square wave signal as tach input to the dissy. Both centrifugal and vacuum advance remains operational to ensure the best line-up of the rotor with the HT terminal. MS is therefore only advancing/ retarding a delta on top of what the dissy is already doing using the built-in VB921 IGBT.

It was interesting to see what AFRs the twin SU's produce.... Mostly around 12.5 going up to 13.5 in a best case scenario and getting as rich as 11.5 upon full throttle!!

Tomorrow the whole inlet manifold comes off...

PS: This truck happens to have a dual battery setup. This made it convenient to power the LC-1 from the second battery which does not have to source the starter with current while cranking. Does not seem to be helping much as this battery is somewhat flat and LC-1 certainly is not happy with that.

Philip Lochner